Dave -- Just to clarify. I don't think the Admin -- either the civilians or the military -- is planning to withdraw before the Iraqis have the basic capacity to govern themselves. But it's also pretty clear that we're not planning to hang around indefinitely until a liberal democracy has flowered. Or even before the jihadists are run out of the country. For one thing, the continued presence of US forces is a two-edged sword -- undoubtedly feeding terrorism and insurgency even while necessary to contain them. For another, there's no reason to assume that low-level conflict won't continue for some number of years to come, even if the majority of the Sunnis decide to join the government. The big problem will be if the Sunni leadership can't buy into a constitutional solution accceptable to the Shi'a and Kurds. Then the US will be faced with the impossible dilemmas of negotiating the US posture within a Lebanon-style scenario. That probably means taking the Shi'a/Kurd side, assuming the Shi'a want the US to hang around instead of relying on their own militia and the Iranians. If we hang around for a civil war, we'll just get caught in various sides trying to manipulate the US for their own agendas -- a no-win situation if there ever was one. In that case, we may be looking at a scenario where the US withdraws from Iraq itself but maintains a pretty big quick reaction presence in the neighborhood as a guarantor for the Kurds and the government in Baghdad.